From Cauldron to MGA9 stable?

[Markus Robert Kessler]

Hello everyone!

I run several machines with MGA7. I didn't want to switch to MGA8,
because the makers of Mageia were working on MGA9 to release for more
than two years now, and I waited for MGA9 to directly replace MGA7. That
was my favourite.

But, as it looks like, MGA9 is still under development. They say, that
there are still lots of packages that persistently refuse to compile.

Does someone have experience with MGA9 Cauldron yet?

Can this be deployed for normal office applications, VPN, video
conferencing, some multimedia like cutting videos, playing SW
synthesizers and such tasks, without the risk that everything turns to
dust after the next "update testing"?

What, if MGA9 Cauldron will be made to MGA9 stable one day? Can
everything be kept, and only the package repo definitions have to be
updated?

Lots of questions, I know :-)

But, I need these machines for doing my job and some MGA7 packages are
too outdated to be still used. There is also limited feasibility to
selectively backport newer packages, because the dependencies go through
the roof.

Thanks for any idea!

Best regards,

Markus

[William Unruh]

So why not update to Mga8?. Note that you will probably not be able to
update directly from Mag7 to mga9. You will have to do a fresh install
and then update all of your configurations by hand. Mageia does not try
to make such an update possible. 7-8 should work as should 8-9 but 7-9
may well not work, and noone has tested it.
As to when 9 will be released, their usual answer is "when it is ready".

Post by Markus Robert Kessler
Hello everyone!
I run several machines with MGA7. I didn't want to switch to MGA8,
because the makers of Mageia were working on MGA9 to release for more
than two years now, and I waited for MGA9 to directly replace MGA7. That
was my favourite.
But, as it looks like, MGA9 is still under development. They say, that
there are still lots of packages that persistently refuse to compile.
Does someone have experience with MGA9 Cauldron yet?
Can this be deployed for normal office applications, VPN, video
conferencing, some multimedia like cutting videos, playing SW
synthesizers and such tasks, without the risk that everything turns to
dust after the next "update testing"?
What, if MGA9 Cauldron will be made to MGA9 stable one day? Can
everything be kept, and only the package repo definitions have to be
updated?
Lots of questions, I know :-)
But, I need these machines for doing my job and some MGA7 packages are
too outdated to be still used. There is also limited feasibility to
selectively backport newer packages, because the dependencies go through
the roof.
Thanks for any idea!
Best regards,
Markus

[Markus Robert Kessler]

Hi, thanks for that hint!

Sorry if I didn't say it clearly enough: I always do a clean, new
install, whenever I switch to a new distro. Though, in many cases, such
an upgrade will work somehow.

But as for now, if you install MGA8, then, maybe the next day they
communicate that MGA8 is obsolete, and now MGA9 is out indeed. Dropping
bugfixes support for MGA8. So, in my opinion, it makes no sense to go
this step.

Best regards,

Markus

Post by William Unruh
So why not update to Mga8?. Note that you will probably not be able to
update directly from Mag7 to mga9. You will have to do a fresh install
and then update all of your configurations by hand. Mageia does not try
to make such an update possible. 7-8 should work as should 8-9 but 7-9
may well not work, and noone has tested it.
As to when 9 will be released, their usual answer is "when it is ready".

Post by Markus Robert Kessler
Hello everyone!
I run several machines with MGA7. I didn't want to switch to MGA8,
because the makers of Mageia were working on MGA9 to release for more
than two years now, and I waited for MGA9 to directly replace MGA7.
That was my favourite.
But, as it looks like, MGA9 is still under development. They say, that
there are still lots of packages that persistently refuse to compile.
Does someone have experience with MGA9 Cauldron yet?
Can this be deployed for normal office applications, VPN, video
conferencing, some multimedia like cutting videos, playing SW
synthesizers and such tasks, without the risk that everything turns to
dust after the next "update testing"?
What, if MGA9 Cauldron will be made to MGA9 stable one day? Can
everything be kept, and only the package repo definitions have to be
updated?
Lots of questions, I know :-)
But, I need these machines for doing my job and some MGA7 packages are
too outdated to be still used. There is also limited feasibility to
selectively backport newer packages, because the dependencies go
through the roof.
Thanks for any idea!
Best regards,
Markus

[William Unruh]

Post by Markus Robert Kessler
Hi, thanks for that hint!
Sorry if I didn't say it clearly enough: I always do a clean, new
install, whenever I switch to a new distro. Though, in many cases, such
an upgrade will work somehow.
But as for now, if you install MGA8, then, maybe the next day they
communicate that MGA8 is obsolete, and now MGA9 is out indeed. Dropping
bugfixes support for MGA8. So, in my opinion, it makes no sense to go
this step.

But this means that you should still be at Mageia 1 since the new
version is always due in future. I would estimate that 9 will come out
around Christmas (based on zero insider information). And you say that
some of the programs you need are outdated and no longer run. That would
suggest that it is worth it to upgrade to 8 now, so that you are not
left in the lurch, or worse left wide open to hackers entering your
machine through holes in that out of date software
7 has long ceased having security updates. .

Post by Markus Robert Kessler
Best regards,
Markus

Post by William Unruh
So why not update to Mga8?. Note that you will probably not be able to
update directly from Mag7 to mga9. You will have to do a fresh install
and then update all of your configurations by hand. Mageia does not try
to make such an update possible. 7-8 should work as should 8-9 but 7-9
may well not work, and noone has tested it.
As to when 9 will be released, their usual answer is "when it is ready".

Post by Markus Robert Kessler
Hello everyone!
I run several machines with MGA7. I didn't want to switch to MGA8,
because the makers of Mageia were working on MGA9 to release for more
than two years now, and I waited for MGA9 to directly replace MGA7.
That was my favourite.
But, as it looks like, MGA9 is still under development. They say, that
there are still lots of packages that persistently refuse to compile.
Does someone have experience with MGA9 Cauldron yet?
Can this be deployed for normal office applications, VPN, video
conferencing, some multimedia like cutting videos, playing SW
synthesizers and such tasks, without the risk that everything turns to
dust after the next "update testing"?
What, if MGA9 Cauldron will be made to MGA9 stable one day? Can
everything be kept, and only the package repo definitions have to be
updated?
Lots of questions, I know :-)
But, I need these machines for doing my job and some MGA7 packages are
too outdated to be still used. There is also limited feasibility to
selectively backport newer packages, because the dependencies go
through the roof.
Thanks for any idea!
Best regards,
Markus

[Markus Robert Kessler]

Post by William Unruh

Post by Markus Robert Kessler
Hi, thanks for that hint!
Sorry if I didn't say it clearly enough: I always do a clean, new
install, whenever I switch to a new distro. Though, in many cases, such
an upgrade will work somehow.
But as for now, if you install MGA8, then, maybe the next day they
communicate that MGA8 is obsolete, and now MGA9 is out indeed. Dropping
bugfixes support for MGA8. So, in my opinion, it makes no sense to go
this step.

But this means that you should still be at Mageia 1 since the new
version is always due in future. I would estimate that 9 will come out
around Christmas (based on zero insider information). And you say that
some of the programs you need are outdated and no longer run. That would
suggest that it is worth it to upgrade to 8 now, so that you are not
left in the lurch, or worse left wide open to hackers entering your
machine through holes in that out of date software 7 has long ceased
having security updates. .

Post by Markus Robert Kessler
Best regards,
Markus

Hi,

Post by William Unruh
around Christmas (based on zero insider information) [..]

nice to know.

Well, whenever a security-related bug is found, I go and get the source
of the new, bugfixed version. But as said, doing so, including building
all packages which this one is depending on, is very time consuming and
the effort goes through the roof. Sooner or later this won't work anymore.

So, what about installing MGA9 Cauldron now, and use it as MGA9 stable
when it is released?
At least the repo definitions have to be updated, since during
development in Cauldron there is no 'update' repo. Right?
All stuff seems to be in one place.

Someone already tried this with MGA9 / Cauldron, or any former version?

Thanks,
best regards,

Markus

Post by William Unruh

Post by Markus Robert Kessler

Post by William Unruh
So why not update to Mga8?. Note that you will probably not be able to
update directly from Mag7 to mga9. You will have to do a fresh install
and then update all of your configurations by hand. Mageia does not
try to make such an update possible. 7-8 should work as should 8-9
but 7-9 may well not work, and noone has tested it.
As to when 9 will be released, their usual answer is "when it is ready".

Post by Markus Robert Kessler
Hello everyone!
I run several machines with MGA7. I didn't want to switch to MGA8,
because the makers of Mageia were working on MGA9 to release for more
than two years now, and I waited for MGA9 to directly replace MGA7.
That was my favourite.
But, as it looks like, MGA9 is still under development. They say,
that there are still lots of packages that persistently refuse to
compile.
Does someone have experience with MGA9 Cauldron yet?
Can this be deployed for normal office applications, VPN, video
conferencing, some multimedia like cutting videos, playing SW
synthesizers and such tasks, without the risk that everything turns
to dust after the next "update testing"?
What, if MGA9 Cauldron will be made to MGA9 stable one day? Can
everything be kept, and only the package repo definitions have to be
updated?
Lots of questions, I know :-)
But, I need these machines for doing my job and some MGA7 packages
are too outdated to be still used. There is also limited feasibility
to selectively backport newer packages, because the dependencies go
through the roof.
Thanks for any idea!
Best regards,
Markus

[David W. Hodgins]

Post by Markus Robert Kessler
nice to know.

I'm expecting it to be before the end of the month at the latest. I'm the
leader of the qa team.

Post by Markus Robert Kessler
Well, whenever a security-related bug is found, I go and get the source
of the new, bugfixed version. But as said, doing so, including building
all packages which this one is depending on, is very time consuming and
the effort goes through the roof. Sooner or later this won't work anymore.

That's a lot of work. :-)

Post by Markus Robert Kessler
So, what about installing MGA9 Cauldron now, and use it as MGA9 stable
when it is released?
At least the repo definitions have to be updated, since during
development in Cauldron there is no 'update' repo. Right?
All stuff seems to be in one place.
Someone already tried this with MGA9 / Cauldron, or any former version?

It should work. Once m9 is released, existing cauldron installs should
automatically become m9 installs through an update, though I've forgotten
the details of how that works. I don't remember if the repos must be manually
removed/re-added or if that's automatic. Pretty sure it's automatic, and
packagers must alter their configurations to continue with using cauldron
when a new cauldron repo is forked.

There will be very few changes between now and when m9 is released unless
something major and unexpected happens.

Regards, Dave Hodgins

[David W. Hodgins]

Post by Markus Robert Kessler
Hi, thanks for that hint!
Sorry if I didn't say it clearly enough: I always do a clean, new
install, whenever I switch to a new distro. Though, in many cases, such
an upgrade will work somehow.
But as for now, if you install MGA8, then, maybe the next day they
communicate that MGA8 is obsolete, and now MGA9 is out indeed. Dropping
bugfixes support for MGA8. So, in my opinion, it makes no sense to go
this step.

Currently some minor cleanup is being done based on testing of the Mageia 9
rc iso images, which were released July 21st.

I expect the final iso images will start qa testing within a few days.

How long that takes depends entirely on what, if any problems are found,
and how many times the 6 iso images have to be rebuilt and retested, and
what problems are found in testing upgrades from m8.

If things go well, we're looking at about 10 to 14 days until Mageia 9 is ready
to release.

Once m9 is released, support for m8 will continue for another three months, as
it's been more than 18 months since m8 was released.

Regards, Dave Hodgins

[William Unruh]

Post by David W. Hodgins

Post by Markus Robert Kessler
Hi, thanks for that hint!
Sorry if I didn't say it clearly enough: I always do a clean, new
install, whenever I switch to a new distro. Though, in many cases, such
an upgrade will work somehow.
But as for now, if you install MGA8, then, maybe the next day they
communicate that MGA8 is obsolete, and now MGA9 is out indeed. Dropping
bugfixes support for MGA8. So, in my opinion, it makes no sense to go
this step.

Currently some minor cleanup is being done based on testing of the Mageia 9
rc iso images, which were released July 21st.
I expect the final iso images will start qa testing within a few days.
How long that takes depends entirely on what, if any problems are found,
and how many times the 6 iso images have to be rebuilt and retested, and
what problems are found in testing upgrades from m8.
If things go well, we're looking at about 10 to 14 days until Mageia 9 is ready
to release.
Once m9 is released, support for m8 will continue for another three months, as
it's been more than 18 months since m8 was released.

support should not depend on how old the distro is. To some extent it
has been a rolling release anyway since loads of packages have been
renewed.
Mind you I guess that the number of volunteers for packaging and testing
has decreased, giving a longer and longer time between releases.

Post by David W. Hodgins
Regards, Dave Hodgins

[David W. Hodgins]

Post by William Unruh
support should not depend on how old the distro is. To some extent it
has been a rolling release anyway since loads of packages have been
renewed.

When packages are older than the upstream providers of those packages, fixes
for security bugs get harder and harder to apply. We don't have enough people
to properly maintain multiple Mageia releases. The three months guaranteed
support after the next release is released, is there to allow people time to
upgrade.

Version updates in a stable release are the exception, as per
https://wiki.mageia.org/en/Updates_policy#Version_Policy

The reason Mageia is not a rolling release is that with a rolling release, any
update may include configuration changes that have to be done manually.

By staying with the same version of packages within a release as much as
possible, it means that such configuration changes only occur when upgrading
to the next release.

Post by William Unruh
Mind you I guess that the number of volunteers for packaging and testing
has decreased, giving a longer and longer time between releases.

The time period between the releases depends a lot on when there have been
enough changes between the current stable release and cauldron to justify
the amount of work it takes, both for Mageia to create and test, and for
Mageia users to upgrade. The amount of work involved can be a factor
due to the time it takes to properly implement a change such as the one
that went from initd to the systemd. Same with the addition of ipv6
support.

The number of people on each of the teams has remained pretty consistent over
the years. We have lost some people, but we've also gained some people.

Regards, Dave Hodgins

[m***@noneofyour.business]

Post by David W. Hodgins
If things go well, we're looking at about 10 to 14 days until Mageia 9 is ready
to release.
Regards, Dave Hodgins

Hi David,

When is MGA 9 ready for release you think?

Ofcourse the right answer is : when it is ready.
But as you mentioned in two weeks, I'm becoming curious if all is right?

I downloaded the RC, but if #9 is due to come, I'll rather wait for that.

Regards,

Marc.

[David W. Hodgins]

Post by m***@noneofyour.business

Post by David W. Hodgins
If things go well, we're looking at about 10 to 14 days until Mageia 9 is ready
to release.
Regards, Dave Hodgins

Hi David,
When is MGA 9 ready for release you think?
Ofcourse the right answer is : when it is ready.
But as you mentioned in two weeks, I'm becoming curious if all is right?
I downloaded the RC, but if #9 is due to come, I'll rather wait for that.

The second build of the final iso images are currently being tested. If all
goes well m9 should be released later this week.

Regards, Dave Hodgins

[red floyd]

Post by David W. Hodgins
The second build of the final iso images are currently being tested. If all
goes well m9 should be released later this week.

That's awesome, Dave! Thanks!

[marc]

Post by David W. Hodgins

Post by m***@noneofyour.business

Post by David W. Hodgins
If things go well, we're looking at about 10 to 14 days until Mageia 9 is ready
to release.
Regards, Dave Hodgins

Hi David,
When is MGA 9 ready for release you think?
Ofcourse the right answer is : when it is ready.
But as you mentioned in two weeks, I'm becoming curious if all is right?
I downloaded the RC, but if #9 is due to come, I'll rather wait for that.

The second build of the final iso images are currently being tested. If all
goes well m9 should be released later this week.
Regards, Dave Hodgins

That's great news to hear. I'll wait for the MGA9 instead of using the RC.
Marvelous achievement by the devellopers and every one else that worked
on this edition!

I'll repeat my yearly donation, I encourage more users to do that.

Marc.

[Daniel65]

Post by David W. Hodgins

Post by m***@noneofyour.business

Post by David W. Hodgins
If things go well, we're looking at about 10 to 14 days until
Mageia 9 is ready to release.
Regards, Dave Hodgins

Hi David,
When is MGA 9 ready for release you think?
Ofcourse the right answer is : when it is ready. But as you
mentioned in two weeks, I'm becoming curious if all is right?
I downloaded the RC, but if #9 is due to come, I'll rather wait for that.

The second build of the final iso images are currently being tested.
If all goes well m9 should be released later this week.
Regards, Dave Hodgins

Waiting with bated breath!! ;-P Thanks guys.

[marc]

Post by David W. Hodgins

Post by m***@noneofyour.business

Post by David W. Hodgins
If things go well, we're looking at about 10 to 14 days until Mageia 9 is ready
to release.
Regards, Dave Hodgins

Hi David,
When is MGA 9 ready for release you think?
Ofcourse the right answer is : when it is ready.
But as you mentioned in two weeks, I'm becoming curious if all is right?
I downloaded the RC, but if #9 is due to come, I'll rather wait for that.

The second build of the final iso images are currently being tested. If all
goes well m9 should be released later this week.
Regards, Dave Hodgins

Hi David,

Now that MGA9 is offically announced, how many days will it take before
the update applet in the system tray will be activated?
If I remember well, in the past there was a delay of two or three days?

Marc.

[David W. Hodgins]

Post by m***@noneofyour.business
Hi David,
Now that MGA9 is offically announced, how many days will it take before
the update applet in the system tray will be activated?
If I remember well, in the past there was a delay of two or three days?
Marc.

It will be shown when there are updates ready for installation. Currently the
updates repos are all empty. That will change when there are updates that affect
m9.

Note that if you were using cauldron prior to m9 being released, you should run
"urpmi --auto-update" to get the last updates. If you're using rpmdrake, in
order to speed things up it doesn't check the release repos for updates.

Regards, Dave Hodgins

[marc]

Post by David W. Hodgins

Post by m***@noneofyour.business
Hi David,
Now that MGA9 is offically announced, how many days will it take before
the update applet in the system tray will be activated?
If I remember well, in the past there was a delay of two or three days?
Marc.

It will be shown when there are updates ready for installation. Currently the
updates repos are all empty. That will change when there are updates that affect
m9.
Note that if you were using cauldron prior to m9 being released, you should run
"urpmi --auto-update" to get the last updates. If you're using rpmdrake, in
order to speed things up it doesn't check the release repos for updates.
Regards, Dave Hodgins

I seem to remember that with the update from M7 to M8, there appeared a
special colored update applet (red exclamation mark) in the system tray,
for upgrading online to the new M8.

I just checked that I have tickt the box for this special relese upgrade
in the MCC chapter "Configure updates frequency".

I also made sure the new repositories (dated 23 Aug 2023) are in the
repository list.

Still, no red exclamation mark in the system tray.

Regards,

Marc.

[David W. Hodgins]

Post by marc

Post by David W. Hodgins

Post by m***@noneofyour.business
Hi David,
Now that MGA9 is offically announced, how many days will it take before
the update applet in the system tray will be activated?
If I remember well, in the past there was a delay of two or three days?
Marc.

It will be shown when there are updates ready for installation. Currently the
updates repos are all empty. That will change when there are updates that affect
m9.
Note that if you were using cauldron prior to m9 being released, you should run
"urpmi --auto-update" to get the last updates. If you're using rpmdrake, in
order to speed things up it doesn't check the release repos for updates.
Regards, Dave Hodgins

I seem to remember that with the update from M7 to M8, there appeared a
special colored update applet (red exclamation mark) in the system tray,
for upgrading online to the new M8.
I just checked that I have tickt the box for this special relese upgrade
in the MCC chapter "Configure updates frequency".
I also made sure the new repositories (dated 23 Aug 2023) are in the
repository list.
Still, no red exclamation mark in the system tray.

Is the mirror that system is using up-to-date? There's a problem a one of the
tier 1 mirrors, mirrors.kernel.org, and all of the mirrors that sync from it.

To switch mirrors use
# urpmi.removemedia
Then run drakrpm-edit-media, select File, add a specific media mirror, and
select a mirror that shows as green at https://mirrors.mageia.org/status

Once that's done, install all of the updates after which mgaapplet should show
the upgrade option.

Messages have been sent to kernel.org, but no response or change yet.

Regards, Dave Hodgins

[David W. Hodgins]

Post by David W. Hodgins

Post by marc

Post by David W. Hodgins

Post by m***@noneofyour.business
Hi David,
Now that MGA9 is offically announced, how many days will it take before
the update applet in the system tray will be activated?
If I remember well, in the past there was a delay of two or three days?
Marc.

It will be shown when there are updates ready for installation. Currently the
updates repos are all empty. That will change when there are updates that affect
m9.
Note that if you were using cauldron prior to m9 being released, you should run
"urpmi --auto-update" to get the last updates. If you're using rpmdrake, in
order to speed things up it doesn't check the release repos for updates.
Regards, Dave Hodgins

I seem to remember that with the update from M7 to M8, there appeared a
special colored update applet (red exclamation mark) in the system tray,
for upgrading online to the new M8.
I just checked that I have tickt the box for this special relese upgrade
in the MCC chapter "Configure updates frequency".
I also made sure the new repositories (dated 23 Aug 2023) are in the
repository list.
Still, no red exclamation mark in the system tray.

Is the mirror that system is using up-to-date? There's a problem a one of the
tier 1 mirrors, mirrors.kernel.org, and all of the mirrors that sync from it.
To switch mirrors use
# urpmi.removemedia
Then run drakrpm-edit-media, select File, add a specific media mirror, and
select a mirror that shows as green at https://mirrors.mageia.org/status
Once that's done, install all of the updates after which mgaapplet should show
the upgrade option.
Messages have been sent to kernel.org, but no response or change yet.

I was wrong, sorry. The flag that triggers mgaapplet to consider upgrading has
not been set. mgaapplet uses mirrorlist when it adds the new repos. If mirrorlist
determines kernel.org or one of the mirrors that sync from it is the closed
geographicall, the selected mirror won't have all of the latest updates.

I expect the sysadmins won't set it until the problem with the mirrors has been
fixed.

You can still go ahead using text mode though. See
https://wiki.mageia.org/en/How_to_choose_the_right_Mageia_upgrade_method

Just make sure the mirror you select is up-to-date at
https://mirrors.mageia.org/status

Regards, Dave Hodgins

[TJ]

Post by David W. Hodgins

Post by m***@noneofyour.business
Hi David,
Now that MGA9 is offically announced, how many days will it take before
the update applet in the system tray will be activated?
If I remember well, in the past there was a delay of two or three days?
Marc.

It will be shown when there are updates ready for installation. Currently the
updates repos are all empty. That will change when there are updates that affect
m9.
Note that if you were using cauldron prior to m9 being released, you should run
"urpmi --auto-update" to get the last updates. If you're using rpmdrake, in
order to speed things up it doesn't check the release repos for updates.
Regards, Dave Hodgins

Because Cauldron has already been converted to Mageia 10 development,
before running the above command the user should make sure the repos on
the system are not still for cauldron.

I didn't do that this morning on a laptop, and wound up with a Mageia 10
install where my Mageia 9 used to be. On the plus side, it seemed very
stable...

TJ

[marc]

Post by TJ

Post by David W. Hodgins

Post by m***@noneofyour.business
Hi David,
Now that MGA9 is offically announced, how many days will it take before
the update applet in the system tray will be activated?
If I remember well, in the past there was a delay of two or three days?
Marc.

It will be shown when there are updates ready for installation. Currently the
updates repos are all empty. That will change when there are updates that affect
m9.
Note that if you were using cauldron prior to m9 being released, you should run
"urpmi --auto-update" to get the last updates. If you're using rpmdrake, in
order to speed things up it doesn't check the release repos for updates.
Regards, Dave Hodgins

Because Cauldron has already been converted to Mageia 10 development,
before running the above command the user should make sure the repos on
the system are not still for cauldron.
I didn't do that this morning on a laptop, and wound up with a Mageia 10
install where my Mageia 9 used to be. On the plus side, it seemed very
stable...
TJ

Thanks for the warning, TJ. Yesterday I had set the new repros on
active, but now realize that I have possibly set the cauldron repros on
active.
Will turn this back, and wait until the sysadmins of Mageia have set the
flag for triggering the MGA9 in the mgaapplet.

@DavidHodgins: I wonder what makes the mirror-kernel-org down for such a
long time? Isn't that the most important channel for all distros to
update? Seems not very professional to me...

Marc.

[David W. Hodgins]

Post by marc
@DavidHodgins: I wonder what makes the mirror-kernel-org down for such a
long time? Isn't that the most important channel for all distros to
update? Seems not very professional to me...

We don't control the mirrors. I suspect that whoever normally monitors the
syncing and the email used to report problems was not available.

http://mirrors.kernel.org/mageia/distrib/9/x86_64/media/core/release/media_info/
shows it started syncing again. As it includes syncing all of the new cauldron,
it will take several hours to finish. Then we have to wait at least a day for
the mirrors that sync from it to sync too.

https://mirrors.mageia.org/status gets updated every ten minutes iirc.

Regards, Dave Hodgins

[David W. Hodgins]

Post by David W. Hodgins

Post by marc
@DavidHodgins: I wonder what makes the mirror-kernel-org down for such a
long time? Isn't that the most important channel for all distros to
update? Seems not very professional to me...

We don't control the mirrors. I suspect that whoever normally monitors the
syncing and the email used to report problems was not available.
http://mirrors.kernel.org/mageia/distrib/9/x86_64/media/core/release/media_info/
shows it started syncing again. As it includes syncing all of the new cauldron,
it will take several hours to finish. Then we have to wait at least a day for
the mirrors that sync from it to sync too.
https://mirrors.mageia.org/status gets updated every ten minutes iirc.

kernel.org is fully synced now. Thomas reported that it was a networking issue
at kernel.org that caused them to switch to a backup system, but they neglected
to notify mageia, and that backup system was not authorized to access the
primary mirror.

So it was a communication issue. They thought the problem was on our end, we
thought it was on their end, as the cause not being communicated clearly.

It will likely take a day for the other 9 mirrors that sync from kernel.org
to fully sync.

Regards, Dave Hodgins

[marc]

On Tue, 29 Aug 2023 13:42:26 -0400, David W. Hodgins

Post by David W. Hodgins

Post by marc
@DavidHodgins: I wonder what makes the mirror-kernel-org down for such a
long time? Isn't that the most important channel for all distros to
update? Seems not very professional to me...

We don't control the mirrors. I suspect that whoever normally monitors the
syncing and the email used to report problems was not available.
http://mirrors.kernel.org/mageia/distrib/9/x86_64/media/core/release/media_info/
shows it started syncing again. As it includes syncing all of the new cauldron,
it will take several hours to finish. Then we have to wait at least a day for
the mirrors that sync from it to sync too.
https://mirrors.mageia.org/status gets updated every ten minutes iirc.

kernel.org is fully synced now. Thomas reported that it was a networking issue
at kernel.org that caused them to switch to a backup system, but they neglected
to notify mageia, and that backup system was not authorized to access the
primary mirror.
So it was a communication issue. They thought the problem was on our end, we
thought it was on their end, as the cause not being communicated clearly.
It will likely take a day for the other 9 mirrors that sync from kernel.org
to fully sync.
Regards, Dave Hodgins

Thanks for the explanation, Dave. I'll be patient.

Wouldn't it be an idea to mention this status info on the blog.mageia.org?

BTW What strikes me, is that even MGA8 today is not fully synced on any
of the mirors. Most show that the software is 12 hours old.


Marc.

[David W. Hodgins]

Post by marc

On Tue, 29 Aug 2023 13:42:26 -0400, David W. Hodgins

Post by David W. Hodgins

Post by marc
@DavidHodgins: I wonder what makes the mirror-kernel-org down for such a
long time? Isn't that the most important channel for all distros to
update? Seems not very professional to me...

We don't control the mirrors. I suspect that whoever normally monitors the
syncing and the email used to report problems was not available.
http://mirrors.kernel.org/mageia/distrib/9/x86_64/media/core/release/media_info/
shows it started syncing again. As it includes syncing all of the new cauldron,
it will take several hours to finish. Then we have to wait at least a day for
the mirrors that sync from it to sync too.
https://mirrors.mageia.org/status gets updated every ten minutes iirc.

kernel.org is fully synced now. Thomas reported that it was a networking issue
at kernel.org that caused them to switch to a backup system, but they neglected
to notify mageia, and that backup system was not authorized to access the
primary mirror.
So it was a communication issue. They thought the problem was on our end, we
thought it was on their end, as the cause not being communicated clearly.
It will likely take a day for the other 9 mirrors that sync from kernel.org
to fully sync.
Regards, Dave Hodgins

Thanks for the explanation, Dave. I'll be patient.
Wouldn't it be an idea to mention this status info on the blog.mageia.org?
BTW What strikes me, is that even MGA8 today is not fully synced on any
of the mirors. Most show that the software is 12 hours old.

The issue at kernel.org was resolved yesterday. While the status page currently
shows red, the dates indicate it's ok. It's red as updates are being worked on
after a week or so of updates being on hold during the final iso testing. Most of
the 9 mirrors that sync from kernel.org are in the same state.

The blog will be updated soon. Same with things like the download links,
various web pages, etc.

Regards, Dave Hodgins

[David W. Hodgins]

Post by marc
BTW What strikes me, is that even MGA8 today is not fully synced on any
of the mirors. Most show that the software is 12 hours old.

That's partly due to the way the status is determined.

When there's no updates for more than the period shown, and then there is
an update, all mirrors will be shown as being behind for that period.

So if it's been 12 hours since an update was created in one of the updates
testing repos for the stable releases, or in the release repos for cauldron,
and then one is created, all mirrors are at least 12 hours out-of-date until
they sync again. Tier 1 mirrors sync at least once per hour. Other mirrors
usually sync less often.

Regards, Dave Hodgins

[Bit Twister]

Post by Markus Robert Kessler
Hello everyone!
I run several machines with MGA7. I didn't want to switch to MGA8,
because the makers of Mageia were working on MGA9 to release for more
than two years now, and I waited for MGA9 to directly replace MGA7. That
was my favourite.
But, as it looks like, MGA9 is still under development. They say, that
there are still lots of packages that persistently refuse to compile.
Does someone have experience with MGA9 Cauldron yet?

Yep, working pretty good for me.

Post by Markus Robert Kessler
Can this be deployed for normal office applications, VPN, video
conferencing, some multimedia like cutting videos, playing SW
synthesizers and such tasks, without the risk that everything turns to
dust after the next "update testing"?

Well, Cauldron is in rc1 state at the moment.

In my stupid opinion, anyone maintaining more than just their home
computer needs to be testing Cauldron just to make sure there are
no surprises.

I know I keep 4 partitions just for safety, Previous, Current, Next and
cauldron. Cauldron is where I do testing. I cycle through the
other three on each release and keeping previous release makes it
easy to compare configuration files if needed. Next partition
is where I do the Official Release and final operational testing of
the new release.

All of which are clean install followed by any updates.

[TJ]

Post by Markus Robert Kessler
Hello everyone!
I run several machines with MGA7. I didn't want to switch to MGA8,
because the makers of Mageia were working on MGA9 to release for more
than two years now, and I waited for MGA9 to directly replace MGA7. That
was my favourite.
But, as it looks like, MGA9 is still under development. They say, that
there are still lots of packages that persistently refuse to compile.
Does someone have experience with MGA9 Cauldron yet?
Can this be deployed for normal office applications, VPN, video
conferencing, some multimedia like cutting videos, playing SW
synthesizers and such tasks, without the risk that everything turns to
dust after the next "update testing"?
What, if MGA9 Cauldron will be made to MGA9 stable one day? Can
everything be kept, and only the package repo definitions have to be
updated?
Lots of questions, I know :-)
But, I need these machines for doing my job and some MGA7 packages are
too outdated to be still used. There is also limited feasibility to
selectively backport newer packages, because the dependencies go through
the roof.
Thanks for any idea!
Best regards,
Markus

I have been using Cauldron/MGA9 Plasma as my production install on one
desktop and two laptops for months now. I have found it to be remarkably
stable.

In the early stages of Cauldron development, it's true that some
applications may get updated in such a way that they "break" existing
settings. But, MGA9 Cauldron is very much past the stage where this is
likely to happen.

I believe the transition from Cauldron to MGA9 Official will be
automatic. I do not recall needing to do anything when MGA8 Cauldron
became Official.

You should be aware that almost immediately after MGA9 is released, work
will begin on Mageia 10. That doesn't mean that Mageia 10 will come
along and replace Mageia 9 in a few days, weeks, or months. Whenever
Mageia 10 becomes ready, MGA9 will be supported for at least 18 months
after the MGA9 release, or 3 months after the release of Mageia 10,
whichever is longer.

TJ

[TJ]

Post by TJ
I have been using Cauldron/MGA9 Plasma as my production install on one
desktop and two laptops for months now. I have found it to be remarkably
stable.
In the early stages of Cauldron development, it's true that some
applications may get updated in such a way that they "break" existing
settings. But, MGA9 Cauldron is very much past the stage where this is
likely to happen.
I believe the transition from Cauldron to MGA9 Official will be
automatic. I do not recall needing to do anything when MGA8 Cauldron
became Official.

I have learned that the transition from Cauldron to Mageia 9 is not
quite as "automatic" as I thought.

If you have Mageia 9 installed and running from when it was in Cauldron,
you'll need to run, as root, the command "urpmi --auto-update" to
complete the transition.

TJ

[Gilberto F da Silva]

Post by Markus Robert Kessler
Hello everyone!
I run several machines with MGA7. I didn't want to switch to MGA8,
because the makers of Mageia were working on MGA9 to release for
more than two years now, and I waited for MGA9 to directly replace
MGA7. That was my favourite.
But, as it looks like, MGA9 is still under development. They say,
that there are still lots of packages that persistently refuse to
compile.
Does someone have experience with MGA9 Cauldron yet?
Can this be deployed for normal office applications, VPN, video
conferencing, some multimedia like cutting videos, playing SW
synthesizers and such tasks, without the risk that everything turns
to dust after the next "update testing"?
What, if MGA9 Cauldron will be made to MGA9 stable one day? Can
everything be kept, and only the package repo definitions have to
be updated?
Lots of questions, I know :-)
But, I need these machines for doing my job and some MGA7 packages
are too outdated to be still used. There is also limited
feasibility to selectively backport newer packages, because the
dependencies go through the roof.
Thanks for any idea!

My approach to this would be to install Mageia 9 on another partition
and use multiboot. If something goes terribly wrong, just start Mageia
7 again.



- --

Abraços

Gilberto F da Silva

Mageia release 9 (Official) for x86_64
Kernel: 6.4.9-desktop-2.mga9
Desktop: KDE

[David W. Hodgins]

Post by Gilberto F da Silva
My approach to this would be to install Mageia 9 on another partition
and use multiboot. If something goes terribly wrong, just start Mageia
7 again.

I still use opera from Mageia 4 for email, usenet, rss, etc. After I installed
Mageia 5, I temporarily added the Mageia 4 repos, installed opera, and then
removed the mga4 repos (keeping a copy of the rpm packages). When I upgrade to
the next release, I uninstall those mga4 packages to ensure they don't cause
problems, do the upgrade, and then re-install them. This install has been
upgraded each release starting with mga3. The prior releases were on another
system that failed after a lightning strike, before I bought a ups and this
system.

Regards, Dave Hodgins

[Gilberto F da Silva]

On Wed, 30 Aug 2023 15:09:58 -0400, Gilberto F da Silva

Post by Gilberto F da Silva
My approach to this would be to install Mageia 9 on another
partition and use multiboot. If something goes terribly wrong,
just start Mageia 7 again.

I still use opera from Mageia 4 for email, usenet, rss, etc. After
I installed Mageia 5, I temporarily added the Mageia 4 repos,
installed opera, and then removed the mga4 repos (keeping a copy of
the rpm packages). When I upgrade to the next release, I uninstall
those mga4 packages to ensure they don't cause problems, do the
upgrade, and then re-install them. This install has been upgraded
each release starting with mga3. The prior releases were on
another system that failed after a lightning strike, before I
bought a ups and this system.

Just like you, I get upset when an app I like is discontinued. I
really liked superkaramba but it got to the point where it only worked
on openSUSE. It no longer worked in Slackware or Mageia. I redid the
themes used by me for conky and abandoned superkaramba for good.
Struggling to run an old program when there are other current options
working doesn't seem like a good way to spend time. There is Opera on
the flathub. https://flathub.org/pt-BR/apps/search?q=opera


- --

Abraços

Gilberto F da Silva

Mageia release 9 (Official) for x86_64
Kernel: 6.4.9-desktop-2.mga9
Desktop: KDE

[David W. Hodgins]

Post by Gilberto F da Silva
Just like you, I get upset when an app I like is discontinued. I
really liked superkaramba but it got to the point where it only worked
on openSUSE. It no longer worked in Slackware or Mageia. I redid the
themes used by me for conky and abandoned superkaramba for good.
Struggling to run an old program when there are other current options
working doesn't seem like a good way to spend time. There is Opera on
the flathub. https://flathub.org/pt-BR/apps/search?q=opera

So far, it just works. No struggle involved. Handles simple web pages, email
using pop3/pop3s/imap/imaps, usenet, and rss feeds. It has other features too
such as irc support, but other then testing it at one point, haven't use that
much. For web pages that don't work in it (most things other then Mageia sites),
it was easy to customize to add opening links in firefox or chromium.

I have 308,000 email and usenet messages stored in it that I've chosen to keep
for one reason or another, and around 18,500 messages that I've sent. Having
this archive makes it much easier to keep track of how and/or why things were
done or fixed.

Opera stopped producing this program with opera 4.16. What they distribute now
is just a web browser that is a customized version of chromium. No support for
things like email or usenet.

Eventually I'll have to switch to a different program, but until it starts
requiring a lot of effort to keep, it fits with the way I do things with the
qa team.

Regards, Dave Hodgins

[Gilberto F da Silva]

On Thu, 31 Aug 2023 07:11:31 -0400, Gilberto F da Silva

Post by Gilberto F da Silva
Just like you, I get upset when an app I like is discontinued. I
really liked superkaramba but it got to the point where it only
worked on openSUSE. It no longer worked in Slackware or Mageia. I
redid the themes used by me for conky and abandoned superkaramba
for good. Struggling to run an old program when there are other
current options working doesn't seem like a good way to spend
time. There is Opera on the flathub.
https://flathub.org/pt-BR/apps/search?q=opera

Eventually I'll have to switch to a different program, but until it
starts requiring a lot of effort to keep, it fits with the way I do
things with the qa team.

Since 2,453,398 (someday at the beginning of 2.005) I keep a personal
diary. I chose to use flat text instead of using a text processor like
Word or some equivalent. Even so I had to change several times the way
I performed it. At first I used some version of Windows and PGP 6.X

Over time, it was difficult to get the new PGP versions, the method it
used to encrypt using the clipboard began to have difficulties with
BOM used by the OpenOffice, which add some characters at the beginning
of the text.

At some point I had to rewrite the routine of the OpenOffice BASIC
headers in some other language when I decided to use Emacs. I also
adopted UTF8 instead of the code pages. I had to convert the old files
to UTF8.

I wrote the texts and then used KGPG to encrypt them. Now I use EMACS
internal functions to do this.

They have often occurred that I have to change the way you do tasks.

- --

Abraços
Gilberto F da Silva
Mageia release 9 (Official) for x86_64
Kernel: 6.4.9-desktop-2.mga9
Desktop: KDE

[Gilberto F da Silva]

On Thu, 31 Aug 2023 07:11:31 -0400, Gilberto F da Silva

Post by Gilberto F da Silva
Just like you, I get upset when an app I like is discontinued. I
really liked superkaramba but it got to the point where it only
worked on openSUSE. It no longer worked in Slackware or Mageia. I
redid the themes used by me for conky and abandoned superkaramba
for good. Struggling to run an old program when there are other
current options working doesn't seem like a good way to spend
time. There is Opera on the flathub.
https://flathub.org/pt-BR/apps/search?q=opera

So far, it just works. No struggle involved. Handles simple web
pages, email using pop3/pop3s/imap/imaps, usenet, and rss feeds. It
has other features too such as irc support, but other then testing
it at one point, haven't use that much. For web pages that don't
work in it (most things other then Mageia sites), it was easy to
customize to add opening links in firefox or chromium.
I have 308,000 email and usenet messages stored in it that I've
chosen to keep for one reason or another, and around 18,500
messages that I've sent. Having this archive makes it much easier
to keep track of how and/or why things were done or fixed.
Opera stopped producing this program with opera 4.16. What they
distribute now is just a web browser that is a customized version
of chromium. No support for things like email or usenet.

Unfortunately it happens a lot of programs that we like to be
discontinued or modified so that we don't like it anymore. In theory,
Open Source would solve it. In fact we cannot modify sources codes.


- --
Abraços
Gilberto F da Silva
Mageia release 9 (Official) for x86_64
Kernel: 6.4.9-desktop-2.mga9
Desktop: KDE

[faeychild]

Post by Gilberto F da Silva
Unfortunately it happens a lot of programs that we like to be
discontinued or modified so that we don't like it anymore. In theory,
Open Source would solve it. In fact we cannot modify sources codes.

It's called progress. The authors seem to cast about looking for stuff
to change purely to appear to be doing something.

As some would unkindly suggest

"Re-arranging the deck chairs on the Titanic"

[marc]

This morning the mgaapplet finally announced that the upgrade from MGA8
to MGA9 was ready to install. Mirror servers here in Europe were lagging
behind untill two days ago.

In exactly twenty minutes the more than 2500 rpm's were downloaded and
installed.

Reboot went flawlessly. Now up-and-running smoothly.

Thanks to all that helped building this new distro.

It's time for me to donate again to the Mageia foundation. Wish that
more users would do this.

Regards,

Marc.

[Markus Robert Kessler]

Post by marc
This morning the mgaapplet finally announced that the upgrade from MGA8
to MGA9 was ready to install. Mirror servers here in Europe were lagging
behind untill two days ago.
In exactly twenty minutes the more than 2500 rpm's were downloaded and
installed.
Reboot went flawlessly. Now up-and-running smoothly.
Thanks to all that helped building this new distro.
It's time for me to donate again to the Mageia foundation. Wish that
more users would do this.
Regards,
Marc.

Just for the records:

A 'urpmi --auto-update' made my system try to get new packages from
cauldron, which now is MGA10.

To prevent mcc from doing so, I edited /etc/urpmi/urpmi.cfg
by changing every occurrence of 'cauldron' into '9'.

I simply did this in vi: ':%s/cauldron/9/'

Now, a 'urpmi --auto-update', as well as mcc ==> update makes the machine
take new packages from MGA9.

Markus

[William Unruh]

Post by Markus Robert Kessler

Post by marc
This morning the mgaapplet finally announced that the upgrade from MGA8
to MGA9 was ready to install. Mirror servers here in Europe were lagging
behind untill two days ago.
In exactly twenty minutes the more than 2500 rpm's were downloaded and
installed.
Reboot went flawlessly. Now up-and-running smoothly.
Thanks to all that helped building this new distro.
It's time for me to donate again to the Mageia foundation. Wish that
more users would do this.
Regards,
Marc.

A 'urpmi --auto-update' made my system try to get new packages from
cauldron, which now is MGA10.
To prevent mcc from doing so, I edited /etc/urpmi/urpmi.cfg
by changing every occurrence of 'cauldron' into '9'.
I simply did this in vi: ':%s/cauldron/9/'
Now, a 'urpmi --auto-update', as well as mcc ==> update makes the machine
take new packages from MGA9.

Yes, that is a problem. That is presumably why Mageia had a link from9
to cauldron before 9 was released, and probably soon from 10 to
cauldron.

[David W. Hodgins]

Post by William Unruh

Post by Markus Robert Kessler

Post by marc
This morning the mgaapplet finally announced that the upgrade from MGA8
to MGA9 was ready to install. Mirror servers here in Europe were lagging
behind untill two days ago.
In exactly twenty minutes the more than 2500 rpm's were downloaded and
installed.
Reboot went flawlessly. Now up-and-running smoothly.
Thanks to all that helped building this new distro.
It's time for me to donate again to the Mageia foundation. Wish that
more users would do this.
Regards,
Marc.

A 'urpmi --auto-update' made my system try to get new packages from
cauldron, which now is MGA10.
To prevent mcc from doing so, I edited /etc/urpmi/urpmi.cfg
by changing every occurrence of 'cauldron' into '9'.
I simply did this in vi: ':%s/cauldron/9/'
Now, a 'urpmi --auto-update', as well as mcc ==> update makes the machine
take new packages from MGA9.

Yes, that is a problem. That is presumably why Mageia had a link from9
to cauldron before 9 was released, and probably soon from 10 to
cauldron.

The link doesn't normally get added until after iso testing starts, though
there is no reason it couldn't be done sooner.

Regards, Dave Hodgins

[William Unruh]

Post by David W. Hodgins

Post by William Unruh

Post by Markus Robert Kessler

Post by marc
This morning the mgaapplet finally announced that the upgrade from MGA8
to MGA9 was ready to install. Mirror servers here in Europe were lagging
behind untill two days ago.
In exactly twenty minutes the more than 2500 rpm's were downloaded and
installed.
Reboot went flawlessly. Now up-and-running smoothly.
Thanks to all that helped building this new distro.
It's time for me to donate again to the Mageia foundation. Wish that
more users would do this.
Regards,
Marc.

A 'urpmi --auto-update' made my system try to get new packages from
cauldron, which now is MGA10.
To prevent mcc from doing so, I edited /etc/urpmi/urpmi.cfg
by changing every occurrence of 'cauldron' into '9'.
I simply did this in vi: ':%s/cauldron/9/'
Now, a 'urpmi --auto-update', as well as mcc ==> update makes the machine
take new packages from MGA9.

Yes, that is a problem. That is presumably why Mageia had a link from9
to cauldron before 9 was released, and probably soon from 10 to
cauldron.

The link doesn't normally get added until after iso testing starts, though
there is no reason it couldn't be done sooner.

Yes, I discovered that with 10. However, one should not be installing
say 10/cauldron before iso testing has started anyway, and I suspect the
Kessler did not not install 9/cauldron before iso testing started
anyway.

Unless you are an official tester there seems no point in doing so.
Although making the link earlier, probably does not have many downsides,
except perhaps encouraging the naive to install the new version before
it is ready.

Post by David W. Hodgins
Regards, Dave Hodgins